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12th Armored Division >> General Discussion >> information regarding my dad
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Author Topic:  information regarding my dad
Joanie Hull
Junior Member
Member # 9631

Posts: 7
From: Interlaken, NY
Registered: 8/12/2012
posted 10/14/2015 7:57:34 PM    Click here to view the profile for Joanie Hull  Click here to email Joanie Hull  edit/delete post  Reply w/Quote
Hi, I would like to try again to find out some information about my dad. His name is Philip Hull (42 111 823) Technician Fifth grade and he was with the 12th armored division with the 23rd tank battalion. He left for Europe on the SS Queen Elizabeth on March 25th, 1945 and arrived April 1, 1945 in Scotland, train to Southampton and by boat to LeHavre, France. Then by train to Verviers, Belgium and was there from April 9th - 18th and then into battle. If anyone would have anymore information or know anything about him or have any ideas for finding people who knew him, I'd appreciate your help. Thanks and God bless you all.

MikeWoldenberg
Junior Member
Member # 16

Posts: 859
From: University at Buffalo (NY)
Registered: 6/1/2004
posted 10/15/2015 2:07:35 AM    Click here to view the profile for MikeWoldenberg  Click here to email MikeWoldenberg  edit/delete post  Reply w/Quote
Hello Joanie, I note that you began your
search here in 2012. Somehow, I established
that he was in the Service Company of the 23rd Tank Battalion. My first reaction is the same. Please look to the left and click on
BOOKS AND WRITTEN EXPERIENCES. Then scroll
all the way down to find the book on the
23rd Tank Battalion. The chapter
on April and May, 1945 is very detailed and
will give you a day by day account of where
your Dad was. The Division was moving south
through towns such as Ansbach as they approached the Danube River. See the maps of their progress. They captured the bridge at Dillingen and then
came upon some sub camps of the Dachau concentration camps. These were located near
Landsberg.

I will get back to you with ideas about finding people who may have known him.
This may be difficult because he arrived quite late, April 1945, as a replacement.

Mike Woldenberg

Joanie Hull
Junior Member
Member # 9631

Posts: 7
From: Interlaken, NY
Registered: 8/12/2012
posted 10/15/2015 9:27:00 AM    Click here to view the profile for Joanie Hull  Click here to email Joanie Hull  edit/delete post  Reply w/Quote
Thanks and I really appreciate your help. I did read through the book & watched the videos. We do have a couple of pictures of my dad in Schrobenhausen & a couple of other pictures, does that help? How exactly does it work with the CCA, CCB & CCR & the 23rd tank battalion? I looked at the maps and could see which direction towards Austria the 12th armored division was headed but how can u tell exactly what the 23rd was attached to? Did it get split up between CCA, CCB, CCR or how can I tell exactly who he was with? He was a gunner in a tank and stayed until May of 1946. I am so thankful for your help. I think with me living in the Czech Republic it makes me even more interested as to where my dad was. We do also have some names of people in his diary. Should I try and look up these names? Thanks again

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posted 10/15/2015 1:44:47 PM  Reply w/Quote
CCA,CCB, & CCR (reserve), were combat commands. In an armored division, each combat command usually consisted of a tank battalion, armored infantry battalion, field artillery battalion, and various other units. All of the elements in a division's combat commands can be moved between the commands according to needs. If your father was a tank gunner, it's more than likely he was part of one of the line companies in the 23rd Tank Battalion, Companies A, B, C, or D. Or possibly Headquarters Company, which had a Tank Section consisting of two medium tanks. There are just a handful of men left, who served with the 23rd Tank Battalion. The enlisted men did not usually fraternize with other men who served in different companies. Due to his short duration with the unit, the possibility that he would be remembered, is very remote.

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posted 10/15/2015 1:47:54 PM  Reply w/Quote
If you could post the names mentioned in your father's diary, that would be very interesting, and might be helpful.

MikeWoldenberg
Junior Member
Member # 16

Posts: 859
From: University at Buffalo (NY)
Registered: 6/1/2004
posted 10/16/2015 3:51:40 AM    Click here to view the profile for MikeWoldenberg  Click here to email MikeWoldenberg  edit/delete post  Reply w/Quote
Hi Joanie, Here is how the Combat Commands were organized: CCA had 43rd Tank Batt.,
66th Armored infantry batt., and 493rd Armored Field Artillery Batt.

CCB had 714th Tank Batt., 56th Armd Inf. Batt.
and 494th Armd Field Artill. Batt.

CCR had 23rd Tank Batt., 17th Armd Infntry Batt. and 495th Armored Field Artill. Batt.

Thus each was essentially one third of a division and were sent out on various missions. There was some mixing of specific companies between combat commands as needed. Within each combat command there were "task forces." Each task force had companies from the battalions as needed for the job.

I am traveling and need to check on which Company your Dad was with. If he was in the
Service Company, I am not sure exactly how they fit into the fighting. I need to verify his company.

Since your Dad was treated after the war, it is possible that he went to the V.A. after his discharge. The V.A. would have stored his records somewhere. I would ask them how
to follow up on that question.

Give us the names of the men he mentioned
and we may get lucky.

The 12th Armored was headed towards Czechoslovakia but then turned south and headed for Dillingen and points south and into the Alps. They wanted to prevent the
Germans from setting up a defense in the Alps.

(The bridge at Dillingen was captured intact by Combat Command A). CCR headed for a town
to the west of Dillingen, but the bridge was
blown there and so they went over the bridge
at Dillingen. CCA was headed for a bridge to the east of Dillingen, but there bridge was blown up as well. So they also crossed the Danube at Dillingen. Then many divisions
crossed there.

Mike Woldenberg

Mike



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Unregistered

posted 11/8/2016 3:23:52 PM  Reply w/Quote
Hi Mike, Wow, it's been too long. Sorry that I haven't gotten back to you sooner. Time sure seems to slip by. I would like to ask if you have any more ideas in terms of how I can find out more information about my dad and also if there might possibly be someone out there still alive who might have known him. I did read through & tried the things you mentioned. I will look back through to make sure that I didn't miss anything. I think I posted a couple of names of people who he wrote about in his diary. I can check and see if there are anymore. Currently I have been getting to know a Jewish lady from my Czech town (where I am a missionary, but am from upstate NY) who survived the Holocaust and was sent out by her mother with the Nicholas Winton children's transports to England. Much of her family ended up in the camps and didn't make it. Thanks again and hopefully this time I can follow up on all your insights and helpful information. Thanks for all you do.